It was all or nothing..

[future2112]

Those who know me know that i rarely bluff. but on this occasion, after raising with a farely strong hand and being re-reaised after the flop, i figured i had to push rather than fold. I think it was rather me calling their bluff than me bluffing, tho. But either way it paid off and i was pretty pleased it did. So i wanna share the hand...

Everleaf Gaming Game #304130218
***** Hand history for game #304130218 *****
Blinds 100/200 NL Hold'em - 2011/09/05 - 21:21:08
Table 2
Seat 2
Total number of players: 6
Seat 1: Scorpion3333 ( 8457 Chips )
Seat 2: future2112 ( 2050 Chips )
Seat 3: jregis ( 3245 Chips )
Seat 4: okiegene ( 860 Chips )
Seat 7: francese777 ( 3748 Chips )
Seat 10: LegalLady ( 10860 Chips )
jregis: posts 100 Chips]
okiegene: posts 200 Chips]
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to future2112 ]
francese777 folds
LegalLady folds
Scorpion3333 folds
future2112 400 Chips]
jregis 300 Chips]
okiegene folds
** Dealing Flop ** ]
jregis checks
future2112 checks
** Dealing Turn ** ]
jregis checks
future2112: 200 Chips]
jregis 400 Chips]
future2112 200 Chips]
** Dealing River ** ]
jregis: 200 Chips]
future2112 1,250 Chips]
jregis folds
future2112 does not show cards
future2112 wins 2200 chips from main pot

[ultimodragon]

I think you did well there mate,i dont like to post on threads like these much as im by no way an expert,but hey ho im getting there..
Im guessing he had a similar hand,but probably weaker..i would have had him by the turn as either on a bluff or low pair..but the 200 pokey bet,i would have played the same as you Mate,hammer time!
It just dosnt look convicing enough to be a slow play..and obviously with your all in call they didnt have much..well done!

Sorry i find it hard to comment on hands,because theres so much more to take into consideration...

But i love a good bluff as much as a good hand or good fold

But what do i know about bluffing?

[CaptainSandy]

Well done, it's so difficult to comment without knowing what he was holding, lol.

[stjimmy]

Very well played mate, hard to comment though, would really need to see how he played last 10 hands or so to do so.

[future2112]

Yeah is difficult to say what he was holding and i think the 8 on the river possibly put him off calling the all-in call by me.

ulti, as for the little pokey 200 bet, sometimes i use a little pokey bet similar to that to draw a raise or keep them in the hand so i can draw more chips when ive hit the nuts. An all-in too early could scare some off. Never see a pokey bet as weakness! but in this case i think you're right. And, again, i think the river 8 helped.

[pokerpus]

Originally Posted by stjimmy

Very well played mate, hard to comment though, would really need to see how he played last 10 hands or so to do so.

i couldn't read a word of this post.... stjimmy's photo was freaking me out

scary..... i tell you what ....

[DukeOfDeath]

First of all he's defending his blinds. At BEST I think he has a medium pair like 7s. People defend with absolutely nothing all the time. Trick is absolutely nothing hits sometimes. But since you raised preflop he has to know you have something. So my guess is he actually did have something, but I doubt anything better than a 9 or maybe even a draw. No matter what he had I think your image and lack of bluffs, helped you out.

Funny how you're pokey bet got a min raise which you didn't respect, and his pokey bet got a shove from you which he DID respect. Difference between you two.

[future2112]

Originally Posted by DukeOfDeath

First of all he's defending his blinds. At BEST I think he has a medium pair like 7s. People defend with absolutely nothing all the time. Trick is absolutely nothing hits sometimes. But since you raised preflop he has to know you have something. So my guess is he actually did have something, but I doubt anything better than a 9 or maybe even a draw. No matter what he had I think your image and lack of bluffs, helped you out.

Funny how you're pokey bet got a min raise which you didn't respect, and his pokey bet got a shove from you which he DID respect. Difference between you two.

I really appreciate your input DD coz i know you have a good knowledge of the game. You describe how players more oftern than not defend their blinds, and i think thats exactly what he was doing. I wouldnt say i didnt respect his pokey bet though coz i certainly did, but i had to make a decision as to whether he did have a hand or not. I think if i had more chips i may have folded but due to my low stack i decided to try and capitalise on the good cards i had. It was a good hand of poker played out slowly with long pauses between each card, a raise, a re-raise, a bet, a call and another raise followed with my push. I cant describe my exact thoughts at the time but i can say that my all-in push wasnt made lightly. Equally i guess his fold was pretty tough too.

thx for all the comments much appreciated. thoroughly enjoy topics like this.

as a side note, and to try and continue this topic.. how or when do you decide to bluff a hand or feel forced to see the hand out?

[DukeOfDeath]

Originally Posted by future2112

as a side note, and to try and continue this topic.. how or when do you decide to bluff a hand or feel forced to see the hand out?

Thanks. I'm definitely still learning this game a lot. That's why I like the dialogue on the forum. As to your question I personally adopt a style (though I can vary that style) of raising instead of limping. To use your hand for instance, AQ is definitely a raisable hand for me. Because like with you it's easier to play against one opponent than the whole table.

Say you raise AQ early position and you do end up with one caller, when do you bluff and when do you see it out? Most importantly vary it up. Continue more than 50% of the time but whether 2/3 or 3/4 or even 4/5 of the time is up to you. Also don't always bet or always slow play when you hit the flop. Likewise don't always bluff or always check/fold when you miss. And you can change it based on pace of the game. It depends on a few things:

• board texture
• position
• perceived images

So board texture is basically just how coordinated the board is. K Q K with 2 diamonds is scary (or wet). 10 3 6 rainbow not as coordinated, not as scary. Other than the possible flush draw your texture was rather dry. So don't always bet dry or never bet wet, but I'd say in your mixing it up between when or when not to continuation bet, more often it should be on boards that even if he DID hit, he did not hit WELL.

Secondly position: If your opponent is just defending blinds, you'll have position. With position you can always have information and the upper hand. Some opponents always bet out when they make a hand, some will slow play, some will check raise, and some will chase from behind (and of course some will do any of these things as a bluff too). The thing is play accordingly. If your opponent believes in the new and exciting script and will never fold then check behind to keep the pot small and get a free card. If the opponent will only call or raise with a good hand and fold the rest, then bet with position to see where you're at (and win more than not).

However if you get called by some one behind you (not in the blinds), be much more ready to give up. Definitely don't automatically give up, though. Again it depends on your opponent. If you are up against a player that loves a flop but gives up without at least a good draw then you should often bet out. If you're against a call station then again pot control and look to steal on river or just showdown for cheap. If your opponent is unpredictable be careful and willing to give up often, but also always mix it up yourself against them.

Finally, perceived image: I already discussed how you play according to how your perceive your OPPONENT'S image. However, increasingly more important as you play better and smarter folks is their perceived image of you. This is kind of common sense along the same lines. If you have been pushing a lot (or shown down a couple bluffs), then decrease your c bet percentage to 50% or possibly even slightly below. If you honestly haven't been getting any cards and watching all the other players limp and bluff and somehow win hands with 72off and the like, you can loosen up. If you're only playing hands once every 2 or 3 rounds then you can almost raise 100% of the time. (key word almost... still consider those other 2 points). In general you have to level with your opponent. It's like my discussion on heads up play which I hope to get soon. In general LEVELING is a huge poker concept and central to a lot of things. I almost need to start a thread just on that. But basically it's one of those I think that they think that I think...etc type of situations, guessing what their move means and what your move will mean to them.

Out think out play and if all else fails out draw your opponent, and you will do well.

In this example you had postion, decent board texture, a solid image, and a rather good read on your opponents style. Based on all those, you made a good play. What he had is not the issue, you won. There will always be those times where it doesn't work, but as long as you're winning more than losing, then you're doing it right.

Keep it up.

[teebs]

Originally Posted by future2112

how or when do you decide to bluff a hand or feel forced to see the hand out?

All I can say is...never bluff a fish Never works, never will lol.