wheres the skill

[telboy]

wheres the skill in onlinepoker.
no disrespect to any of our op players,but wheres the skill in our poker if you can be called with any two cards.
just had my AA cracked by a str8 chase then this
Everleaf Gaming Game #228231365
***** Hand history for game #228231365 *****
Blinds 100/200 NL Hold'em - 2010/12/31 - 08:05:17
Table 1
Seat 10
Total number of players: 6
Seat 1: boklu ( 5296 Chips )
Seat 2: tammybett ( 605 Chips )
Seat 3: jazzsinger1 ( 2239 Chips )
Seat 4: telboy ( 623 Chips )
Seat 6: Maddarcy ( 3375 Chips )
Seat 10: teebs ( 6877 Chips )
boklu: posts 100 Chips]
tammybett: posts 200 Chips]
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to telboy ]
jazzsinger1 folds
telboy 200 Chips]
Maddarcy 200 Chips]
teebs folds
boklu 100 Chips]
tammybett folds
** Dealing Flop ** ]
boklu checks
telboy: 423 Chips]
Maddarcy folds
boklu 423 Chips]
** Dealing Turn ** ]
** Dealing River ** ]
boklu shows ] three of a kind, twos
telboy shows ] two pairs, queens and twos
boklu wins 1646 chips from main pot with three of a kind, twos ]

[CaptainSandy]

That's very unlucky Tel, but looking at boklu's chip stack it's understandable why he matched your all-in.

[fred913]

There has to be a big difference between playing for cash and just for fun. If Tel's hand was played in a cash game with, say, a fifty dollar prize to the winner the j 2 would no doubt have folded, but in our tourneys if you lose one you can play in the next without worrying about your wallet. We have to accept the standard we play in.

[jazzsinger1]

cant agree more with Fred..well said..its all about the money coming into play..i frankly would not make 40% calls for a real money game.bad a pleuthora of bad beats this week..but hey we still here...for the fun of it and for pure playing pleasure...tough luck Tel..sorry had the same situation with you not as bad...have a good year m8 and god bless..
jazz

[symbolon]

Cash or chips..... it's down to the individual style of player. Some are aggressive with very little in their hand but if they have won a few hands the rest fold to them for a while at least.

Some play with their gut ( lots of the best do that) some play because they think they have the better hand.... regardless of style not always will the better hand win.

In cash it's all about what you are prepared to risk, in a tourney with chips to be honest, there is as a chip leader with little to risk. If the hands have been going with the player then he is unlikely to call a halt until he feels his luck has changed.

However, tel I can sympathise but it happens to us all.

xxsymxx

[telboy]

sorry bok for using this as an example,i do admire and respect your game m8.
but my point here is free chips just for fun?.
i try to improve my game and get experience from each tourney i play,so free chips or cash i treat them both the same,the fun part is the chat,and my respect for the game dont change

[Mr_Slick]

Tel, most folks wouldda folded the J2 O/S and also even after the flop, unless there was a chance of an open ended str8. Having said that, I once folded the same hand and guess what happened..? Click to find out.. I never fold that hand until I see the flop myself, then again I have reason not to. Steve.
http://www.onlinepoker66.com/forum/p...ictureid=52268

[SternSwiss]

Yeah, unlucky. The call on flop is really not a good one.

Yesterday night we got double AA's broken by K8 despite huge raises preflop (see this thread) and then I got reraised on my AQ suited by Jayccin (who was going all in one hand out of two or three or so, mostly with crap and a big stack) and got eliminated by J9 (or another equivalent big underdog).

No fun at all. Honestly, even the table was asking questions to jayccin. Is he always like that? I rarely play the guy and thought he was a real player, but what I saw last night was the equivalents of the worst n00bs bingo players everyones loathes.

[jockney]

Tel, I think the hard facts are that your game HAS improved by playing free poker since the times when I first started playing you almost 3 years ago. However you are now playing at a level where you understand the game much better than most of the players on this site. Fred is right in what he says about the standards we play in here and OP66 has been a great experience and has helped guys like you and me learn and improve our games, but there is only so far you can take you game on a "free site" I only come here for the banter and to visit friends these days as unfortunately I also share you frustrations and have realised that if I want to improve my game I need to find a platform where the standard is Higher.

Don't get me wrong, there are a lot of very good players here who are much better than I will ever aspire to be , but because it is a free site there will always be a lot of novices and "donkeys"

I'll always find it hard to let go completely of OP66 and will still play the odd game here, but find myself drawn more to the money side.

Chin up mate, hope to continue playing against you in one capacity or other.

[stjimmy]

Originally Posted by fred913

There has to be a big difference between playing for cash and just for fun. If Tel's hand was played in a cash game with, say, a fifty dollar prize to the winner the j 2 would no doubt have folded, but in our tourneys if you lose one you can play in the next without worrying about your wallet. We have to accept the standard we play in.

Yesterday I played a $11 / Euro7 and a $5 tourney. the play was awfull from about a 3rd of the players. ie, a player with pck2's calling big bets with picture cards on the flop, then hitting their set on the river. I actually believe the standard is better in our 4 daily free tourneys.

[teebs]

I do think the standard of play in the 4 daily tournaments is more than decent. However, i think that online poker play in general has gone completely downhill ( on all sites). People getting their money in on draws, or calling big raises with almost any 2 cards. If u want good poker, live poker is the way to go.

[jazzsinger1]

bottom line with due respect to Bok,a respected player and a friend but either ring or tourney..J2 o/s is not a call on any table unless you are on the button and you happen to hit the flop then play on.its a no caller.

[1701]

Originally Posted by SternSwiss

Yeah, unlucky. The call on flop is really not a good one.

Yesterday night we got double AA's broken by K8 despite huge raises preflop (see this thread) and then I got reraised on my AQ suited by Jayccin (who was going all in one hand out of two or three or so, mostly with crap and a big stack) and got eliminated by J9 (or another equivalent big underdog).

No fun at all. Honestly, even the table was asking questions to jayccin. Is he always like that? I rarely play the guy and thought he was a real player, but what I saw last night was the equivalents of the worst n00bs bingo players everyones loathes.

SterSwiss, jaycin always plays like that, BINGO jay all day, everyday.

[SternSwiss]

Originally Posted by stjimmy

Yesterday I played a $11 / Euro7 and a $5 tourney. the play was awfull from about a 3rd of the players. ie, a player with pck2's calling big bets with picture cards on the flop, then hitting their set on the river. I actually believe the standard is better in our 4 daily free tourneys.

I find that for tournaments the standard of play starts to be ok, somewehere above 50$ buy-in an gets good at around 100$... but with a serious bankroll management, that means between 2000 & 4000$ in the poker bank, so not easy to reach for everyone.

Below that, play is more often than not somewhat random too.

Again: one random player can be a blessing but more than two at a table and you are in a seriously bad shape if you play serious poker, coz anything can (and usually will) happen.

As for here, it varies. Sometimes level is good, sometimes it is afflicting. Also, there is a relatively small pool of players one starts to know, so the conditions can be treacherous for game imporvement.

For me, the only thing that works is study, study, and playing higher stakes.

But I love to play here no less...

Originally Posted by 1701

SterSwiss, jaycin always plays like that, BINGO jay all day, everyday.

Thank you for the info, m8.

[fred913]

Speaking purely for myself I think the standard of play improves in tourneys like the international because no one wants to let their team down. very rarely will a player chance his arm, when he plays purely for himself he takes many chances, if he hits he will be chip leader, if he misses he just registers for the next tourney. You will never stop this happening when there is nothing but a couple of thousand chips at stake. It would be a boring game if the best starting hand always won, it won't happen, even the best, Hansen, Brunson, and company, will play low card hands and win, when they do it we say it's great play. The best pre flop hand will lose one in five maybe, that's what makes it a gambling game.

[SternSwiss]

Originally Posted by fred913

even the best, Hansen, Brunson, and company, will play low card hands and win, when they do it we say it's great play.

yes, but they know what they are doing when they play so: late position, compelling odds, opening table aggression, etc.


They certianly won't play all-in early or mid tournament with low holdings or drawing hands, or many of the more common examples we daily see here (and elsewhere),

[fred913]

Quite right Stern the all-in pre flop merchants on here only do it because they have little to lose but the top players will often play the player and not their hand, even some of the very best like to see a flop providing it doesn't cost too much. How often do you see 2 4 off suit become a good hand when the flop comes 3 6 5, or when Q 9 suited make the nut flush against a premier hand like K K or A K. When it aint going to cost you money you'll gamble. I do all my gambling on the horses, that can be just as frustrating believe me.

[jazzsinger1]

bottom line-CANT BEAT STUPID

[sexynomore]

Tel, you must really hate me and my game then. I play an agressive style. I treat and play my chip stack and position on the table as being almost more important, than the two cards that get dealt to me. My style is a high reward, high lost approach to the game.

I think I have A.D.D. because I can get bored to quickly typically just after the break especially of late.

Now having said that, a J - 2 os would be a far stretch even for me.

T.xx

[fred913]

There is another way to view this, I'll be Devil's Advocate, let's say a person comes on here to enjoy a fun game, he would like to win every now and then but is not chasing the toplists. If he gets a succession of hands like 2 7, 8 3, 9 4, is he not entitled to lose patience and try to see a flop with 6 7 off, if he hits the flop do we then slang him for his play, remember this is free poker, he hasn't played bingo, he just wanted to get involved, is that all bad. The bingo merchants are soon found out and rightly so but our friend who won with his 6 7 is still accused of donkey play. Donkey or not if he wins with his gamble then why not.